Summoners spells balance feedback


#1

Even tho they can be used only when summoning new units, summoners spells have a lot impact on game it self. Lets start by short spells descriptions and finish with possible nerfs/buffs/reworks.


Ameryl - Archangel

Placing a summoner rune stuns all enemies for x seconds.

This one is game changer. It can be used for a lot situations, both offensively and defensively. Here are just some examples:

  • stunning enemy minion to prevent him interact with yours while your minions is attack tower
  • preventing enemy minion from attacking your tower
  • preventing enemy minion from charging to your summoner / attacking it
  • enabling your minions safety attacks on enemy summoner or stunning them just in time so your minions can charge into enemy summoner

In combination with other archangels spells it can sometimes provide long cc on enemy minions giving you even more advantage in taking game objectives (towers then summoner).


Ruul - Pyromancer

Placing a summoner rune ignites all enemy minions for x dmg over y seconds.

This one is ok-ish. It is just a damage over time. Nothing special here. Ignites like most of his spells. Best case scenario for this one is when enemy has a lot of units or when trying to kill new summoned ones.


Mordrake - Necromancer

Placing a summoner rune summons skeletons.

This one is tricky one. So I order to have skeletons you need to have corpses of your units and Mordrake has spells that gives life steal / drain hp in order to keep his minions alive. In early game it is almost useless compare to pyromancer and archangel if you calculate that it sometimes can stack enemy minions (they are stacking when they stop to kill skeleton giving other enemy minions chance to catch up with already summoned) giving your opponent huge minion push.

It is ok summoner spell just to make clear cause it is thematically totally necromancer style.


> Possible nerfs/buffs/reworks:

Obvious thing to do here is nerfing stun duration for archangel and possibly buffing a little necromancer skeletons and maybe faster damage on pyromancer.

However I have some ideas which might work leaving class fantasies intact.

Lets start with Archangel. For her I would personally change her stun into blind. She is holy warrior after all, casting spells with light theme. They way blind works its giving enemy minions 100% miss chance. This would still be good strategic spell but will allow enemy minions to go into your minions which will make it less powerful. Also it will still have that defensive component cause of 100% miss chance.

For pyromancer I would personally nerf damage a little but I would add panic effect into into. Panic effect will cause ignited minins to move a little in random directions for couple of seconds (maybe even just one second). When someone ignites you you just don’t stand in place and do nothing. It is natural that you panic.

And last for necromancer. I think that skeletons even tho they are thematically in place should be removed form summoner spell. Something like fear will serve him just right. He is death it self after all. Fear will make minions run from Mordrake just a little. Or even to be feared in place (but that will work just like archangel’s stun at the moment).

As a summary I believe all summoner spells should be strategic options for players. There needs to be components in them like: Do i need to use it now to prevent some damage, or should I wait for my minion spawn timer. Do I need to use it now to prevent enemy minions for interrupting mine from making damage or will I have enough if I wait a little, Am I rushing enemy summoner in which case I probably wouldn’t care in first two minutes how my summoner spell impacts the game cause all my focus will be on summoning more minions… It will give game extra depth by giving that high risk high reward component in my opinion.


#2

I feel Mordrake’s ability makes a good measure for a balanced ability. Ameryl’s is a bit too strong, and Ruul’s is a bit too weak. I think they are well designed, just the numbers aren’t quite there yet.

I think you’re mostly right here. I’d reduce the duration of Ameryl’s stun by a bit, and would go for slightly faster damage on Ruul. Probably something like 16% over 4 seconds rather than 15% over 5. I don’t think Mordrake’s needs a buff.

The Ruul idea with a panic effect I do not like personally. It’s another cc effect, and Ameryl already
stuns minions. I think having as different special abilities as possible is a good idea, so as to give more of unique feel to each Hero. Having one hero’s ability be about pure damage is fine, and Ruul is correct choice to be about pure damage. He even looks like that :slight_smile:


#3

I agree with @Malvolio and @The_Ev1L_0ne all abilities have to be reworked. A lot of ppl playing Ameryl because of her passive ability and spells which already have stuns.

Ameryl cc is too strong overall. Her passive ability could be a ministun even less then a second, or maybe blind that @The_Ev1L_0ne suggested is not bad.

Ruuls passive is so weak, it have to be a bit stronger, i know its stacked with spells but it cant be compared with Ameryl’s or Mordrake’s ability.

Mordrake’s ability is kinda ok, in late game is so strong, but on start and in midgame is almost useless.


#4

Im sure Ameryl’s ability is way less impactful if used incorrectly, maybe theres a way to nerf the ability to make it less skill based. Maybe half the stun duration but add a minnor damage ie. 5%.

Ruul’s ability is too slow to feel impactful, i feel like if the damage is faster it would be balanced. 15% over 2 or 3 sec.

Mordrake’s ability is fine because it gets really good late game.

At the end of the day, I speak from a small subset of games played at early stage of the game at higher ranks. Hard to say how the game meta change as we level up more. The developers have a greater database all across to compare the win-ratio of the heroes and the popularity of every ability (I least I hope they do).


#5

Agree it is hard to talk about balance without whole picture in front of you. Still I would love to see couple of spells for giant that will do something based on if target is under ignite or not.


#6

You are forgetting that Ruul’s ability besides doing damage over time, also ignites enemies and ignite boosts almost all of his damage spells. Which means that you should cast it when you have spell (or two) ready which is boosted by ignite. For example a very good spell to use with its ability is Scorching Ray, but basically any of Ruul’s AOE dmg spells are good. If you cast them correctly you can usually wipe all of their units, or at least all in one lane.